In this episode, we welcome back to the podcast one of our favourite guests, Chef Chuck Hughes. Chuck stops by the SIAL podcast studio and visits us to chat about his new line of food products - one of which was a finalist in the SIAL innovation awards. We talk about how he decided to get into the food business, what it takes to get products off the menu and onto the shelf and the tricky intersection of innovation and commercial success.
In this episode, we welcome back to the podcast one of our favourite guests, Chef Chuck Hughes. Chuck stops by the SIAL podcast studio and visits us to chat about his new line of food products - one of which was a finalist in the SIAL innovation awards. We talk about how he decided to get into the food business, what it takes to get products off the menu and onto the shelf and the tricky intersection of innovation and commercial success.
Sylvain Charlebois 00:04
Welcome to our summer SIAL special bonus episodes of The Food Professor podcast, presented by Caddle.
Michael LeBlanc 00:13
As the official podcast for the SIAL Food Innovation show this year in Montreal, Sylvain and I had the opportunity to interview the leading thought leaders, brands and makers in the food industry. As the saying goes, these are their stories.
Sylvain Charlebois 00:27
Stay tuned for Season 5 of The Food Professor podcast debuting August 29. We'll be back on the mic together live with our particular brand of truth, insight, interviews, custom research from our friends at Caddle, and yes, a little bit of fun.
Michael LeBlanc 00:48
In this episode, we welcome back to the podcast one of our favorite guests, Chef Chuck Hughes, Chuck stops by the SIAL podcast studio and visits us to chat about his new line of food products, one of which was a finalist in the SIAL Innovation Awards. We talked about how he decided to get into the food business and what it takes to get products off the menu and onto the shelf and the tricky intersection of innovation and commercial success.
Michael LeBlanc 01:12
Chuck Hughes, welcome back to The Food Professor podcasts, how the hell are you?
Chuck Hughes 01:16
Really good. Thanks. Thanks for having me.
Michael LeBlanc 01:17
It's great to see you. We're here at SIAL and-, and you're kind enough to stop in. Your products were finalists in the innovation-, big innovation event and between when we last spoke to you, Sylvain had last spoke to you and today you've launched a whole line of products. I see them at Longos. I saw you on Insta, talking about them at Walmart. Where did the-, did you always want to have your own product line? You've got your own cookbooks, the restaurant. Yell me about the-, the genesis of the idea.
Chuck Hughes 01:45
It's a good question. Honestly. It's one of those-, kind of one of those things that came out of, after 10 years at the restaurant, and you know, the restaurant's actually going to be, June 1st, 18 years.
Michael LeBlanc 01:58
Wow, and Sylvain and I are going to be there tomorrow night.
Chuck Hughes 02:01
Tomorrow.
Michael LeBlanc 02:01
Every time we go to Montreal, Sylvain and I, we always go to the restaurant. Every time.
Chuck Hughes 02:05
Garde Manger, I'm taking reservations as we speak, but so for our 10th year anniversary, we wanted to-, you know, our landlord was a big part of this. He's-, he's a Greek importer of goods that we've been using since day one. So, his olive oil, you know, he's my landlord. He says he sells me like big vats of olive oil and for our 20th anniversary, we said, we should do kind of a special edition gift for for people and-, and it grew into this bigger idea of like, oh, you know-
Michael LeBlanc 02:38
I love your olive oil. That's the first product of yours. I bought, I think-, where did I but it, at Longo's. I love the presentation. I love the bottle.
Chuck Hughes 02:44
And it's good quality, inexpensive. I kind of call it like an everyday use of olive oil where you don't really have to, you know, olive oil runs the gamut. Up until-
Michael LeBlanc 02:56
Super premium then all the way to cheap cheerful.
Chuck Hughes 02:58
And I feel like the ones that are the most expensive are the ones that are the least used, because it's like, it's like truffles, you're like, you know, we get truffles in the restaurant and then like, everybody's nervous because it's expensive, are they gonna yell at me.
Michael LeBlanc 03:11
Don't do an extra shave, if you have an extra shave the margins are gone for the meal.
Chuck Hughes 03:14
Exactly. So it kind of stays there until you know. So it's one of those things. So it kind of started off that way and then you know, products and things that we were doing in recipes at the restaurant and kind of snowballed from there and then now it's been-, it's been a real fun kind of new venture, if you will, you know, cooking since the age of 17, something like that, and the restaurant.
Michael LeBlanc 03:34
And you got and you got the show. You're just telling me you are in Louisiana. So you're still doing the show, but how did you-, how did you fit this in, let me-, I just want to-, I'm curious about your-, both the creative process and the infrastructure to make it happen.
Michael LeBlanc 03:45
You know, you're one guy, you're a family guy-, you got-, you know, you only got a certain amount of time, do you-, did you build an infrastructure? Find some contractors and people who knew what they were doing? Like talk about that a little bit.
Chuck Hughes 03:45
Exactly and that's kind of how we-, we develop the product. So, you know, going back to my landlord, who was really the one who kind of started the idea, in a sense, if you will, and then we-, we made the olive oil and it went really well, and went well, what can we do and so he introduced us to another guy that was kind of making what we were looking to make and little sauces and things that I was doing at the restaurant, but that could be made on a larger scale.
Chuck Hughes 03:45
Yes.
Michael LeBlanc 04:27
Sure. Very important, right, it's one thing to make it for a restaurant scale but another thing to put it into process.
Chuck Hughes 04:33
And that-, that was the huge issue with most of the products that we were doing in the beginning. I had this idea where we wanted to bring quality restaurant, it was mostly sauces because I felt like that's one of the-, you know, there's barbecue there's ketchup there's-, there's a multitude of sauces out there but there's not really a good like a red wine sauce, or a classic kind of sauce where you know, you're buying your own steak. You're buying it but then you grab it bottle of this and it's, you know, yeah, it's a little bit more expensive, but it's-
Michael LeBlanc 05:04
Something you could mix with some shallots and make, like one of your rest-, my favorite recipe of yours, I make it on my show, has and it's got pyrotechnics, so I love it.
Chuck Hughes 05:14
That's the best part.
Michael LeBlanc 05:15
That's the best part, so basically, you know, you put th-, the chipotle pork and then you do a reduction, but you do a reduction of the shallots and some red wine vinegar.
Chuck Hughes 05:25
Yes.
Michael LeBlanc 05:25
And some I used butter tart vodka when I did it, I had this bottle, anyways-
Chuck Hughes 05:30
Amazing.
Michael LeBlanc 05:30
Fantastic, right? So, you're right, you're filling-, you're filling a gap where you've got restaurant quality stuff that's available to the, you know, the average Canadian, right?
Chuck Hughes 05:39
So we went down that path initially and we realized that anybody we wanted to work with, you know, we realize, okay, well, in our restaurant, I'm kind of passing on the cost to the customer. And they're coming for an experience. So they're, they're willing to pay for it.
Michael LeBlanc 05:57
Right.
Chuck Hughes 05:58
But what happened was, well, it was like, $22 a bottle, and nobody's gonna buy that and okay, so where-, what can we do, and unfortunately, like sauces, stocks, all these basic-, the basis of cooking, you can't cheat. So there's no way to cheat around it.
Michael LeBlanc 06:16
No shortcuts.
Chuck Hughes 06:16
Exactly and we always ended up saying, okay, well, we have to compromise and I guess that's what happens with like, companies that are just starting out, you learn along the way and that's what happened with us and we said, kay, well, this is not really gonna work because it's not what we want to do and so we kind of went down the line and said, hey, how about these-, you know, it's not necessarily the most you know, I'm happy we were in the, the one of the finalists for the innovation because it's really here in Quebec, not an innovation but to put them all together is kind of an innovation
Michael LeBlanc 06:47
Mustard coleslaw, by the way. I'm holding a picture of this mustard coleslaw.
Chuck Hughes 06:49
Yeah, so the mustard coleslaw here in Quebec, I mean, you know, hotdog culture, I feel like it was more part of-, now, you know, food is so international and there's everything everywhere and it's not like when I grew up, when you're on the road, or kind of going for a snack, it was always like, poutine and what people know, but-, but the real classic is a steamed hotdog, or steamé, as we call it, and most of the time, you'll order it all dressed, which is basically a relish, mustard, ketchup.
Chuck Hughes 07:23
So we've kind of taken the-, the cole, sorry, the relish, mustard, ketchup, but also all dressed would be relish, mustard, chou. So relish, mustard, relish, mustard, and cabbage. So it's kind of a classic, but what I've done is I've literally put them all together, in-, in an easy to serve and so-
Michael LeBlanc 07:48
And accessible, right.
Chuck Hughes 07:49
Accessible at a price point that's, you know, with ingredients from here, and that's what we have. I'm just talking to my co-packer, Lino, just-, just because obviously everybody's here, right? This is the big show and we're talking I said, so how's how's it going, he goes, well, I know that this time of year, it's always because he's still one of those businesses that they got into growing vegetables and then realize like, hey, we have this surplus of vegetables. What can we do and so right now, today was cauliflower. Tomorrow is eggplant and so they're, they're starting the and-, so as the business grew as my SKUs and my products and like, so-, every two weeks, I'm like, oh, let's try this. As we grow-
Michael LeBlanc 08:30
How many SKUs do you have now? I see like, 10, is ten about right?
Chuck Hughes 08:33
Yeah, probably something 10 or 13. I have, you know, I have the initial one where its-, this is one of these things that at the restaurant, we used to make.
Michael LeBlanc 08:41
Antipasto.
Chuck Hughes 08:41
Yeah, like the jardiniere, that classic Italian pickled vegetables and-, and, you know-
Michael LeBlanc 08:48
You've got the olive oil, you got some other sauces.
Chuck Hughes 08:50
Exactly and so this kind of started it and then we've got now we have a kind of a bruschetta topping that I ended up using on anything else, but bruschetta, really, itsl like, you know, like, I have two young kids, so, I used to be like this. I went through phases, right in my life where I was like a pure restaurant guy, where you barely could even talk to me. You know, I was like, I work to a restaurant, I don't have time to talk to normal people, then, you know, and then owning my own business and realizing, oh, wait-
Michael LeBlanc 09:17
There's a little bit of self correction there.
Chuck Hughes 09:19
Yes, there's a lot more than and so going into this, it's-, it's really kind of working in another realm of food.
Chuck Hughes 09:29
*Oh, it's-, it's insane,
Chuck Hughes 09:30
Humbling and humbling and discouraging in a sense, because-, not necessarily discouraging, but you realize the importance of marketing and visuals and that first glance and that look, which is which is great, but it's also I have a product that most people who try it, love it, but to get them to-, sometimes it's hard. So to me, something that felt very obvious is not obvious to somebody else and so we've had by the amazing journey, we just signed with Walmart Canada, that's like 300 extra stores.
Michael LeBlanc 09:30
Humbling?
Michael LeBlanc 10:05
I saw that. Did you ever-, let's talk about your distribution strategy to get technical a little bit.
Chuck Hughes 10:09
Yeah.
Michael LeBlanc 10:10
You know, I do talk to brands who say, you know, there's this sweet spot, the Goldilocks, between too many points of distribution and the right amount of distribution. How did you think through that, like, what did you-, did you say, I want to be broadly available in Canada, and I'm going to pick a couple of partners, or how did you think about that?
Chuck Hughes 10:29
It's funny, because at first, obviously, you know, it was our new-, new business new venture, I'm a restaurant, we have a small team-
Michael LeBlanc 10:38
Who took the call and took the meeting, right? You gotta start somewhere, right?
Chuck Hughes 10:41
Kind of and-, and so, you know, we started kind of grassroots here in Montreal, small, independent places, it kind of got a little bit of traction and-, and, you know, it's a funny thing, because I'm-, I'm from here, I'm pretty well known, but I'm also well known in the rest of Canada.
Michael LeBlanc 11:01
Sure.
Chuck Hughes 11:01
I've had some-, some US.
Michael LeBlanc 11:03
Media. Yeah.
Chuck Hughes 11:04
Work-, and that I did in the past, but-, but I always kind came back.
Michael LeBlanc 11:07
One of the only winners of the Iron Chef, right, that gave you some views, right?
Chuck Hughes 11:11
I still had it back in the day, I still had it.
Michael LeBlanc 11:13
I bet you still have it today.
Chuck Hughes 11:15
But you know, like that-, that my US is where I was at a point where I was still, I mean, it's not like I'm that old, but I'm a lot older than I was then and I you know, I was new to the Food Network, new to the Food Network in the US, it was all bright and shiny, and hotels and events and I didn't have kids and my restaurant at that point was semi established, after five or six years, I was allowed, I was allowed to allow myself to kind of do other stuff and-, and I sort of got caught up in this-, I guess this, this wave of like, I guess little successes that really brought me other places and realize that like, I don't know, if I really want to sacrifice my lifestyle, playing hockey once in a while and so I realized it was too much.
Chuck Hughes 12:10
And it seemed like it was so amazing and so I came back. Not like I ever left but, you know, I think one year I had, it's the year where I think I had 148 travel days in a year.
Michael LeBlanc 12:22
You can't run at that pace for long, right.
Michael LeBlanc 12:24
No kidding, right. Last question for you. So, last year's winner of the Innovation Award was out of business for six months.
Chuck Hughes 12:24
And you know, the restaurant, I was not there, it was just like one of those and I felt like I just had to keep moving and just don't stop and if you don't stop, well, you know, things can't be bad, but it's not like things went bad, but I was just kind of everywhere and nowhere at the same time and so with the products and refocusing a little bit and, and working on you know, now my kids are 7 and 10, anybody who's worked in the restaurant business, or really any business for that matter that's really kind of involved and hands on, you're gonna miss a lot. So, I, honestly, I wasn't really willing to miss too much. I've got a great work life balance in the sense that like, I still work a lot, I'm still all over, but I'm still there and I can kind of be part of my kids’ lives and you know, things have changed a lot since my parents’ generation and my generation.
Chuck Hughes 13:19
No, what was the-, I don't even know what-
Michael LeBlanc 13:28
It was-, it was a great product, ticked all the boxes, it was called Millennial Tea, it's-, she was-, super smart entrepreneur, they went to Sri Lanka, they picked tea, froze it into cubes, you know, had all this, you know, pop it in your smoothie, do all these things and it-, you know, it ticked all the boxes, right, had all-, innovative obviously, innovative-, food innovation is hard and it's hard to kind of sometimes, you know, be successful because so many people are trying now, what do you think is the secret sauce to to winning, you got a, you got a sense of it today.
Chuck Hughes 14:02
Yeah.
Michael LeBlanc 14:03
You know, is that the insights that were honed as a restaurateur, I gotta think that's got to help, but you think that's the secret sauce? You mentioned marketing, what do you think makes us successful as an innovator?
Chuck Hughes 14:15
It's a good question and you know, before even showing up today, I never would have thought this was an innovative product. You know what I mean, like, it's a funny thing to think about, but-
Michael LeBlanc 14:25
I think there's-, there's-, my fear sometimes and I've seen this many times, a product is so innovative, people can't figure out what to do with it, grocers can't figure out where to put it. So, you're-, you're carrying a lot of water, because you got to educate people as to what the product is.
Chuck Hughes 14:43
Yes.
Michael LeBlanc 14:44
So, I think there's this spectrum where you're, if you're-, too, or not enough-, innovative, you're like, yeah, there's too much substitution or it just doesn't get any attention. That feels like what you're trying to do, kind of walk that, I mean, olive oil isn't particularly innovative. I liked your presentation, and you'd build on your brand kind of thing, is that how you're thinking about it.
Michael LeBlanc 15:02
Yeah.
Chuck Hughes 15:02
Yeah, I mean, for me, the honest truth is I-, as much as I've worked in the food industry, my whole life really, and it's-, it's, you know, to this day, I still love it.
Chuck Hughes 15:13
My tastes are still pretty, not basic, but I go back to the same flavors that I like, and and there's certain, like, there's too much choice now in life, I find and I-
Michael LeBlanc 15:26
It's called-, it's a tyranny of choice.
Chuck Hughes 15:28
So, you know, it's just, there's, there's-
Michael LeBlanc 15:30
It's a bit overwhelming, right? I can't choose. So, you know what I don't choose, I'm so overwhelmed. Sometimes looking at condiment shelves. I'm like, I'm just gonna, just gonna move on.
Chuck Hughes 15:38
So, I think I-, my initial is, you can't get around. Without having just a good product, I think that's the base, the base of anything, it's, it needs to be really, in essence, a good product and that's when people try it. You know, I've, like I said, 10, or 13, little jars, like that spicy, mild, a whole bunch, everybody has their favorite, people will, but yet the flavors are very familiar. Nothing really out of this world, but it's a product that can be used on really anything can kind of-
Michael LeBlanc 16:16
It's like, it's like I say about-, Americans say about Canadians - familiar, but somehow different.
Chuck Hughes 16:21
There you go. For-, I don't know how many years I cooked and never asked one question, you know, I was a line cook, I would show up at 1pm, I would leave at 1am and I would do that, and I did that for 15 years, never really asked any questions. Never really thought about anything else, but going to work and cooking and getting, you know, a meager paycheck.
Michael LeBlanc 16:47
Maybe a family meal if things worked out, right.
Chuck Hughes 16:49
You know, like I literally had no, in a time where working in kitchens wasn't the nicest rosiest place on Earth. Weirdly enough, I was the happiest guy I could have ever seen and I had no idea that, you know, life could be better than that and I never, I think it's when I opened my restaurant and I quit drinking 17 years ago too which kind of opened my eyes to other things in life and-, and, and so, you know, I think my whole experience in life kind of is into these products, in a sense that I've used a lot of the knowledge and the things that I know, but what I base it on the most is, you know, yes, you need good marketing.
Chuck Hughes 17:34
Yes, you need good branding. Yes, you need to work hard. Yes, you need to have the right people, but that that initial bite, and it's kind of what got me into cooking, and still to this day, our restaurant is an open kitchen and you know, somebody who enjoys a meal and who has a genuine like, oh, this is good is still the best paycheck to me personally, in this world. I'm not saying I don't want money. I'll take the money.
Michael LeBlanc 18:02
We'll take that.
Chuck Hughes 18:03
But like, you know, like they say money doesn't buy happiness money. No. It allows you to do great things, but-, but the real things that make you tick, and that-, that make you want to keep going and do this, because as everybody knows the business of restaurants and food is gone like up and down.
Michael LeBlanc 18:21
Tough, tough.
Chuck Hughes 18:22
You know what I mean, so-
Michael LeBlanc 18:22
You know what David Lee Roth said about money, it allows you to bring your boat right alongside of happiness. David Lee Ross.
Chuck Hughes 18:28
There you go.
Michael LeBlanc 18:29
There you go. Words of Wisdom from Van Halen.
Chuck Hughes 18:31
We'll-, we'll take that to the bank.
Michael LeBlanc 18:33
Well, listen, Chuck, it's such a treat to spend a bit more time with you all, I'll put a link in the show notes to our first interview, which tells your life story and congratulations on your success it takes-, it takes a lot to get these products out, get them on the shelf and be successful. So, congratulations.
Chuck Hughes 18:47
I appreciate it and same to you.
Michael LeBlanc 18:49
Well, thank you. Thank you.
Chuck Hughes 18:51
Yeah, I mean, this is not being filmed, is it?
Michael LeBlanc 18:53
This is not being filmed.
Chuck Hughes 18:54
Because now podcasts are, you know, TV on the radio kind of vibe, but-, but we are in a-, in a prominent space here at SIAL.
Michael LeBlanc 19:03
We're very thankful.
Chuck Hughes 19:04
You-, we communicated by email very loosely and you said, you know, you'll be able to find me, to which I said, well, there's a lot of stuff going on. I might not be able to. I was able to find you. This is pretty amazing. So, thank you.
Michael LeBlanc 19:17
Well, I'm happy you did and thanks again for joining me on the mic.
Chuck Hughes 19:20
Cheers.
Michael LeBlanc 19:21
All right.
Sylvain Charlebois 19:24
Thanks for tuning into our summer SIAL bonus interview series. Michael and I will be back live on the microphone together in late August. I'm the Food Professor, Sylvain Charlebois.
Michael LeBlanc 19:37
And I'm Michael LeBlanc, media entrepreneur, consumer growth consultant and keynote speaker. Safe travels everyone. See you back in August.
Sylvain Charlebois 19:46
Take care.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
restaurant, product, Sylvain, food, sauces, olive oil, good, cooking, started, podcast, felt, mustard, innovative, innovation, interview, today, business, Chuck, classic, put